LD Profile - Andy Dunning

Interview and article by Bruce Jordahl

Originally published in the April 2002 issue of PLSN.

When I ask my friend Gary Carnes what production he's most impressed with, he always says 'DC Talk.' Go see one show and you'll know why. For their powerful light show, the group relies on the immeasurable talents of one Andy Dunning. We're pleased to offer this exclusive interview with the man behind the console.

BJ: Hi Andy. Tell us where the Andy Dunning story begins.

Andy Dunning: I grew up in Neenah, Wisconsin - it's a little town half way between Green Bay and Oshkosh. I remember going to my college finals when it was 40 degrees below zero.

BJ: What were your artistic endeavors in high school?

Andy Dunning: We had a nice 1600 seat theatre; I did sound for all of our high school theatre productions, and when visiting artists would use the facility, I'd act as a stagehand and hang out with the lighting guys.

BJ: And in college?

Andy Dunning: I attended the University of Wisconsin in Platville, one of the UW extensions. I graduated with a BS in Fine Arts with a minor in electronics - the BS route was a way to get out of taking even more foreign language courses.

BJ: When did lighting become a career for you?

Andy Dunning: In high school, I knew a local band that did 300 or 400 seaters. I wanted to be their sound guy, but they already had one, so they said 'do you want to do lights?', and the bug bit hard!
I came to the conclusion while working with them that this is something that I want to pursue for a long time. When I got to college, I switched majors a few times, but each time it was for the purpose of learning the lighting trade better, and finding out which department could teach me what I wanted to know for that semester.

BJ: Did you get a chance to stretch your chops in college?

Andy Dunning: The theatre department had only two or three majors going through at a time, so even as a sophomore I was mounting my own shows … the old 'figure it out as you go along' school. By the time I was a senior I was touring in the summer, and doing long weekends with bands.

BJ: How did you hook up with DC Talk?

Andy Dunning: In 1992 I was engaged to be married, so I sold all of the lighting gear I owned and moved to Nashville. About the same time I got a call from DC Talk. I was interviewed by them while my car was loaded driving to get married. I got back from my honeymoon and had my first show.

BJ: You kind of grew up in the industry with DC Talk …

Andy Dunning: I really did - when I was in Wisconsin I was working for a small PA company, I was 'the' lighting guy … trying a lot of things, and nobody ever told me I couldn't do certain stuff … so returning truss that was torqued out of shape was par for the course. When I got out of that and into DC Talk, it just skyrocketed.

BJ: What kind of gear did you take on the road with them in the early 1990's?

Andy Dunning: The first tour with them was basically a PAR rig with some Golden Scan III's thrown in. We carried an Avolites QM console that I ran, and then we had a Compulite Animator for the moving lights. About the time the Whole Hog II came out, I had specified a Hog I for our tour - I didn't even know about the II. Bandit did that tour, and Michael Strickland said, "why do you want to drive an old Chevy when you could be driving a Porsche?" That's been my console of choice since then. But I cut my teeth on the Avo QMs and the Celco Golds - I'm sorry to see those big old rock desks not made anymore.

BJ: What was your production like back then?

Andy Dunning: When we were doing festivals and fairs, I was it. When I started with the guys it was three lead singers and four dancers, a house engineer and a road manager. The first tour we did was with Obie's, so I was just learning how a real company operates and learned how a crew chief can really be helpful.

BJ: What was your design philosophy towards lighting the group?

Andy Dunning: I was trying to balance keeping the money lit versus what made sense visually. Some guys would say 'keep all three lit all the time', but if two of them were just hanging out or doing a dance move or something and one is singing, it didn't make sense to me not to highlight that singer. Every LD will have an opinion on it, but my purpose started out then and still is 'keep the guy who's singing lit' - and there's enough light on stage to pick up the other two, so no problem. I've also learned to use followspot color to highlight given singers. At times, I'll keep all three lit, but use darker color on the ones not singing.

BJ: What excited you about lighting DC Talk?

Andy Dunning: I started doing a lot of alternative and a lot of metal, so that was what I liked and still do. When DC Talk started they were basically white boy rap, and I honestly thought I'd only last three of four shows with them, but their music started involving into a more modern, grungy sound.

BJ: And consequently their production changed …

Andy Dunning: Oh, big time! Where before there was only dancers and lead singers, now we have a real band; a couple tours ago we even carried a mosh pit with us. I've really enjoyed seeing the evolution of their show.

BJ: How has the size of the venues you play changed?

Andy Dunning: It used to be that a big room was a hotel ballroom. During the Jesus Freak and Supernatural shows, we were playing the real arenas everybody else plays. This last run we did was a little bit smaller; a mix of real venues, and some not so real.

BJ: You and the band are big fans of saturated color.

Andy Dunning: Yes, they absolutely hate the pastels. They want to see very saturated colors, and they want to see minimal colors mixed - two color combinations at most - and if they have any complaints about the programming, it's usually going to be too many colors or it's too bright and too happy.

BJ: Let's talk about the increased production elements and touring budget that DC Talk's success has brought.

Andy Dunning: We went from a basic PAR rig with some wiggly lights thrown on it, to an intelligent fixture show, with maybe with some ACLs thrown in or 8-lites with color changers. Also, I was able to start utilizing some non-conventional rig layouts.

BJ: Have you been involved in the set design as well?

Andy Dunning: By default … I wouldn't call myself a set designer, but I end up throwing my two cents in …

BJ: What particular lighting instruments have you spec'd and why?

Andy Dunning: The last tour was Cyber Turbos, x. spots, Studio Colors and the Color Pro 250s. That fixture has been a very pleasant surprise. When they came out my first response was 'I have absolutely no use for a 250-watt fixture.' But when I started using them, I discovered they're awesome truss warmers and they're great on set pieces

BJ: Did you go for any custom patterns on this tour?

Andy Dunning: I had three Apollo custom gobos each in the Cybers and the x. spots. Apollo Design gets product out very quickly, and the price is right …

BJ: How did you deal with introducing video elements into DC Talk's show?

Andy Dunning: This past tour didn't have video, but the two previous tours did; for example, the stained glass imagery was video projection. 99% of the use has been playback of pre-produced images. The only time they ever fiddled with reinforcement is if they're doing band intros … and then they send somebody around the stage with a little Super 8. They really fight the conventional video lighting that so many people are using now. If we're doing an event that is specifically for television then they don't fight it as hard. If they're playing Leno or a Billy Graham crusade - those events are for video first - so it's accepted as a necessary evil. But when one of our tours is videotaped - they typically go to film, not video, because they want the higher contrast - but they won't point in any direction in terms of trying to fix the light show to work on camera. They want to capture the moody, the dark, and the spooky on film the best they can.

BJ: How did the additional musicians on stage change your job?

Andy Dunning: It opened up a ton of possibilities. All of a sudden, instead of just having three lead singers, I had … guitar solos. It adds a whole new dynamic to things.

BJ: How long is the typical DC Talk performance?

Andy Dunning: It's usually about a two and a half hour show. The last tour that we did was different, because each of the three lead singers has a solo record out. The show would start out with DC Talk, then one of the guys solo with his own band, then another guy doing solo stuff with his band, then DC Talk again, then back in to a solo guy with his own band, then back into DC Talk … It became pretty challenging, because the orders were given that the three bands and DC Talk all look distinctly different - and then you have limited truck space, and then the venues' limitations. So it's not like we could carry a different set for each solo artist.

BJ: How did you accomplish that?

Andy Dunning: Each singer had his own backdrop, and it became a system of traveling backdrops. Each guy's music is very different from DC Talk as a whole, and I thought my programming style was very different for each…

BJ: How free form is the operation of the show?

Andy Dunning: Once they get a set list, they pretty much lock into it, but they will play with individual songs - let's add a verse in here or a bridge here, or a freeze …

BJ: Do they tell you beforehand?

Andy Dunning: Sometimes, but they don't hoot and holler if I miss it.

BJ: How has TLS made your life easier with DC Talk?

Andy Dunning: TLS has taken extremely good care of us. I've been ecstatic with their willingness to do exactly what we needed at a very fair price. TLS was the company that did all that curved truss, and David (Milly) was the first of the bidders to say 'don't worry about trying to find something in stock, we will build whatever you want'.

BJ: What are your other interests and where do you find inspiration?

Andy Dunning: When I'm not doing lighting, I'm a big movie buff, and now that the weather's getting nice, I can get the ski boat back out - I can hardly wait! For inspiration, things like the sun poking out behind the clouds after a rain … the huge rays that are coming through the moist air …

BJ: So you're a fan of natural lighting?

Andy Dunning: Oh yes. The colors that are in nature that are extremely difficult to get on stage are usually the ones that I want.

BJ: Do you think as a designer that you perceive color differently that most?

Andy Dunning: I think so. I'm not always the greatest at putting a name on a color - my wife will tell you that, but when I see a color I can really appreciate …

BJ: So you need color mixing in your fixtures ….

Andy Dunning: Yes, although I think the tendency to make all fixtures color mixing only is a bad premise. If you have only color mixing and not fixed colors, there are cues that you can't do. It's the same thing with using all moving head fixtures. There are cues that you just can't do without a moving mirror fixture. It's kind of like having a tool box; you can crack open your toolbox, and there's going to be a screwdriver, a wrench and a pair of pliers. Yes, a screwdriver works very well with screws, but not so good with hex-head bolts.

BJ: Few designers stay with one group this long - has it worked for you?

Andy Dunning: It's been good for me. My career and my abilities have definitely grown in the ten years I've been with DC Talk; at the same time you run the risk of getting pigeon-holed. Because their show is so big and intense, when I try to chase a client that does all ballads, the response is 'you don't know how to light ballads'. Well, give me a chance - I do have a brain in my head. I know you don't run strobes on a ballad.

BJ: At least at full intensity … What other technology excites you?

Andy Dunning: I have loved seeing the evolution of Computer Aided Design in our industry. It has done wonders for me personally, and I think for the industry as a whole. Gone are the days of drawing something on paper, and when the artist needs to see a change, you pull out the eraser or start over. I can show the client three or four drawings very quickly, and if they like them, great, and if they don't, it's not starting all over. I can do a motor move to show that stuff's not going to run in to each other. It's just a phenomenal tool.

BJ: How do you move your rig around?

Andy Dunning: The tours where we've moved the rig, it's always been Skjonberg Controls. I've become a big fan of moving my rig during a show, not necessary as a cue that the audience sees. We go to black and while the singer's talking the rig reconfigures itself for the next song, and it's a totally different look. I love doing that.

BJ: Is there another lighting situation you'd like to get into some day?

Andy Dunning: Financially, the whole trade show / special event world is very appealing, but you don't get that same audience response as when you bring up a real neat cue in front of 20,000 kids - and you hear them gasp. Finding the next alternative, the next musically interesting act that's coming up is very appealing to me.

BJ: How many days of the year are you on the road?

Andy Dunning: About 150. The daily challenge for me is how to make a given rig work in a new venue, but I also really enjoy seeing my show evolve. As the guys go in different directions with their music, I want to take my show in different directions. You get new ideas as you see the show for the 50th time. Songs that you thought looked great in programming all of a sudden are not so great. While some guys like to see the same exact show at the end of the tour as they programmed in the beginning, I am not one of those designers.

Photos from dc Talk's 2002 In Concert and 1999 Supernatural Experience tours can be seen elsewhere on this site.